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 Post subject: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:58 am 
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Hays was an early Texas Ranger and his exploits are legendary During the Mexican War he was the commander of the 1st Reg. of Texas Mounted Votunteers .

Our photo shows Hays with a shotgun over his shoulder. He is pictured with some of his men but he is the center focus of the Dag.. A couple of his men are wearing circa 1840 Forage or Wheel caps..

He and his men are wearing powder flasks and have clay pipes in their mouths..

One great Daguerreotype .

Below we have compared our photo of Hays ,which we believe is circa 1846 , with the photo of him when he was appointed San Francisco County Sheriff in1850. The mat on our Dag has a sandy finish and there is no preserver on the photograph which would date it to around 1847 at the latest .The preserver was first used in 1847 and after.

The comparison photo of him is the earliest we could find. .

Photo compared to the 1850 image of Hays

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They say it is the same man but I am not so sure??

Shotgun


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:40 am 
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I think it is. The pipe smoker and the younger man in suit I think certainly, the shape of their mouths is remarkably similar. and while the pipe smoker and the older man don't bare as close a resemblence (and there are obviously many years between + beard altering face) there is between the two suited men - the hairstyle, albeit reversed, the nose shape is very siimlar. I'd go along with them being the same man rather than not.

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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 7:36 pm 
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The pipe smoker doesn't look like Jack Hays to me. Facially, he seems to have a lighter eye color, eyes that are further apart and fuller lips, etc. He also seems to be huskier than Hays in build as a young man. In general, these gentlemen look more like rough miners protecting a claim than tough rangers defending minors and woman folk.


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:25 am 
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GREAT PHOTO some detective work needs to be done. Where was this photo orginally found?
Can you Date the Photo?
Here's my thoughts. IF this is the legendary Devil Jack and Rangers.. my biggest question is where's the Paterson Colt pistols??? They were top of the line technology back then and they would be proud to display them..(as we see Cowboys displaying the Pistols often in old photos)
Pre Colt Paterson Photo? Check date on Photo again...and still you would think you would see some horse pistols and Bowie knifes as well.
In defense.... Rangers did use Shotguns and powder flasks look right for era. clothes 1840s but you would think you would see some mexican atire as well as they operated out of San Antonio.. I may add more to this...but Great Photo


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 8:14 pm 
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Jimg wrote:
GREAT PHOTO some detective work needs to be done. Where was this photo orginally found?
Can you Date the Photo?
Here's my thoughts. IF this is the legendary Devil Jack and Rangers.. my biggest question is where's the Paterson Colt pistols??? They were top of the line technology back then and they would be proud to display them..(as we see Cowboys displaying the Pistols often in old photos)
Pre Colt Paterson Photo? Check date on Photo again...and still you would think you would see some horse pistols and Bowie knifes as well.
In defense.... Rangers did use Shotguns and powder flasks look right for era. clothes 1840s but you would think you would see some mexican atire as well as they operated out of San Antonio.. I may add more to this...but Great Photo


Good points Jim. I would add that Hays' boys had a fondness for the short 1841 Mississippi rifle, which they called a yager because they resembled the German jager rifles. Incidentally, jager means hunter in German and there were well-known militia units called jagers in different European armies, who performed ranger-like duties.


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:57 pm 
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I'm really not trying to burst bubbles.. If that is Jack Hayes its a very early photo of him and certainly not 1847 for they definately Had COLT Pistols in the Mexican American War 1846-48

IF That is DEVIL JACK and it looks like him..eye browns, nose and earlob.. but That photo would have to be about 1838/9
but then how much photography was being done in San Antonio Texas at the time.
You really need some PROFESSIONAL investigaton to authinicate what maybe the First Photo of Texas Rangers Known


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:14 pm 
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The image looks post Mexican War to me, although I'm no where near a photograph expert.


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 6:10 pm 
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Location: San Antonio
Jimg wrote:
but then how much photography was being done in San Antonio Texas at the time?


A friend of mine, Tom Kailbourn, determined that the first professional photographer in San Antonio was R.P. Kelley, who set up shop in the 2nd floor of the new Masonic Hall near Main Plaza in December 1848.

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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:17 pm 
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Tom would know, he was bourn back then. Actually I think he's still a youngin. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Comparison Photo's of John "Jack" Coffee Hays
PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:57 am 
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I would like to have a digital copy of this picture of Jack Hays without the red text on it. Is it possible?


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